Civics Fail

If the GOP’s ideas about education haven’t already convinced you that they aren’t fit to hold elected office, check out the latest from the vice-Chair of the Montana Republican Party.

In a letter to her constituents posted on a couple of right-wing Facebook pages, MTGOP vice-Chair Jennifer Fielder (TEA-SD 7 Sanders County), writes that New York, Florida, or California “rule over the people here Montana simply because there is more of them than there are of us.”

Here’s Fielder:

Consider that California has 55 of the 535 seats in the U.S. Congress. In stark comparison, Montana only has 3. The number each state gets is based on population. Rural states like Montana don’t stand much of a chance in Washington DC.

Fortunately, our founders guaranteed each state a Republican form of government, meaning we largely rule ourselves.

Is Fielder just figuring this out now?  I guess no one told has told her that about another part of the legislative branch called the U.S. Senate–or how the Senate is set up differently, so that low-population states like Montana have more power per capita than large population states.

Perhaps it is this myopic view of how our government works that led the leaders of 2013 Legislature, Jeff Essmann, Art Wittich, and Jason Priest, to appoint Fielder help grow the size of government by serving on a new government commission.  This new government entity, set up by the Utah legislature, will “collaborate with other States to study the rights, powers, and authority of States to serve as a check on the power of the federal government.”

That’s gonna’ be hard to do if the other participants are as misinformed as Fielder.

Fielder’s entire missive can be found below the fold.

Communication from your State Senate

By Senator Jennifer Fielder, R – Montana State Senate District 7

August 26, 2013


Speaking of freedom

Speaking of freedom, Montana received a rare visit from Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia last week. He appeared by invitation of the Federalist Society, a national organization that is “committed to the principles that the state exists to preserve freedom, that the separation of governmental powers is central to our Constitution, and that it is emphatically the province and duty of the judiciary to say what the law is, not what it should be.”

It was surprising how down to earth Justice Scalia was. He didn’t look or act “supreme” at all. He said a lot of things, but the one that stuck out the most was this: The states cannot keep running to the Supreme Court to solve our problems for us. We have to stand up for ourselves. I recall chief Justice Roberts penning very similar words in the Obama Care ruling last year which practically scolded us when it read, “States are separate and independent sovereigns. Sometimes they have to act like it.”

Why is this important? Well, do you think New York, Florida, or California should rule over the people here Montana simply because there is more of them than there are of us? Of course not. They probably don’t have any idea what’s important to Montanans, nor would they care.

Consider that California has 55 of the 535 seats in the U.S. Congress. In stark comparison, Montana only has 3. The number each state gets is based on population. Rural states like Montana don’t stand much of a chance in Washington DC.

Fortunately, our founders guaranteed each state a Republican form of government, meaning we largely rule ourselves. The federal government is limited to certain enumerated powers defined in the Constitution, and beyond that the people of each state hold the authority to elect their own governor, legislature, judges, and enact our own laws. Thank goodness, because Californians don’t want to be ruled by Montanans any more than Montanans want to be ruled by Californians!

In order to maintain the right of self-governance, the people, congress, courts, state legislatures and even our cities and counties must understand our jurisdiction and role in the separation of powers, and in the checks and balances system so brilliantly designed by our nation’s founders. It takes effort and, at times, courage. But it’s a lot better than being ruled by a dictator isn’t it?

So when the President of the Montana State Senate called upon me the other day, I accepted an assignment to help protect our state sovereignty. The invitation read, in part:

“In an attempt to address the balance of our nation’s unprecedented governing partnership, the State of Utah created the Commission on Federalism, consisting of seven members from both parties of the Utah State Legislature. The commission will collaborate with other States to study the rights, powers, and authority of States to serve as a check on the power of the federal government. We hope to establish a process through which states can work together and, with their congressional delegations, identify and address actions by the federal government that encroach upon the powers that have been reserved to the States and the people.”

The Council of State Governments will convene the Federalism Task Force in Kansas City. I hate flying. And I hate leaving Montana. Especially during elk archery season. But I will honor my oath to support the Constitution, I will heed the words of Justices Roberts and Scalia… and those too of founding father John Dickinson, who wrote, “It will be their own faults if the several states suffer the federal sovereignty to interfere in the things of their respective jurisdictions.”



If you would like to get in touch or help me achieve better government, not bigger government, please drop me a line at


Senator Jennifer Fielder

Montana State Senate – District 7

P.O. Box 2558

Thompson Falls, MT 59873



104 Comments on "Civics Fail"

  1. Talk about a civics fail, how about Daines sending almost thirty volunteers to march in the Dillon Labor parade??? Yep, lots of little blue shirted idiots with Daines written on them, though he ain’t runnin yet, and doesn’t give a rats ass about people who actually work….Labor day Daines went forth in the streets of Dillon to parade for something he doesn’t believe in Fair wages for working Montanans!!!

    • Didn’t I hear from the Montana Wilderness Association (via all those scripted Letters to the Editor supporting Sen Tester’s mandated logging bill and their fancy new website and Ad campaign) that Rep Daines is the Great Bipartisan and not really a Tea Party sympathizer?


        Perhaps you have a quote saying those things to show us? No? You know, one without your BS spin? Nothin’? Well color me surprised.

        Matthew, there are things that make sense and things that don’t. Hatin’ on a player for being awful makes sense. Hatin’ a player because they are on another team doesn’t make as much sense. But hatin’ on a fan because one of the other team’s players may help the fan’s team’s player to a goal? Now that makes no goddamned sense at all.

        Frankly, you might want to get your hearing checked.

      • Drunks for Aguare | September 3, 2013 3:10 PM at 3:10 PM |

        Of course Daines is not a Tea Party sympathizer. As this letter clearly shows, Daines is a great lefty liberal RINO.

      • Of course, Mathew if you read all those bullshit stories. you might as well grow mushrooms in between those ears?????

        Listen, One thing I do on a weekly basis is read votes in washington, and Bills + sponsorship regarding our three Amigos: Bacaus, Tester, and Daines.

        He is worse than Rehberg is for following tea party creed, he has already filed more Heinous earth-hating pro fracking bills, about stealing Montanas water, then I have ever seen.

        He is pro mineral business, and doesn’t give a shit about the people or wildlife in our state as well. his GOP forest bill, is just the latest assault on our forests, and on our heritage of recreation and hunting..

        Daines just another extreme nut with money…. Who will be found out to be just like Bob McDonald is in Virginia. The man’s vote and morality sold to the highest corporate bidder!

        • Norma: I agree with what you are saying regarding Daines being worse than Rehberg for following Tea Party Creed. That’s been my point too. This is why it’s so frustrating to see Montana Wilderness Association completely ignore and remain 100% silent on the Daines/House GOP mandated logging bill and his other assaults on our forests, public lands, natural heritage, etc.

          Instead, Montana Wilderness Association is coordinating a letter to the editor campaign which, in part, is making Daines out to be some great “bipartisan” in an effort to try and convince Daines to support Tester’s mandated logging bill. See:

          What do other progressives in Montana think about Montana Wilderness Association’s strategy? If people working on other progressive issues in Montana (say health care reform, education, social justice, immigration, women’s issues, etc) honestly tried to make Daines out to be some great “bipartisan” champion in order to perhaps gain some traction on their pet issue how would the rest of the progressive community feel about it?

          Truth is, Daines is going to be running for Baucus’ vacant Senate seat, and he knows he has a very good chance of winning it. And with Daines established, miserable track record on environmental and public lands issues firmly in place after less than a year in office (to say nothing of the specifics of Daines/GOP’s own mandated logging bill) how in the world can anyone think that bringing Daines together with Tester on a mandated logging bill for public lands wouldn’t be a huge policy disaster? Thanks the point I’m trying to make here. Thanks.

          • In 2010, just 2% of Montana’s total workforce was made up of folks who work in mining, and oil and gas development. so whats it up to now still maybe just 5%. I dont think giving an industry who continually refuses to hire safety and environmental personal, and shirks its duty to protect its workforce better should be given… Carte Blanche. I also don’t want to see companies who continue to pollute given any sway from tough standards of EPA fines.

            Everyone one of those workers in mineral commodities, could be given permanent jobs in the green energy field, if we stop this coal and Tar sands oil crap now. No one loses if we stop this crap Daines is supporting now!

            Lets face it 65% of the energy we now produce in state goes out of state, and Montanans get nothing to show for it. even in Alaska they pay dividends for all the oil and gas subsidies they get….. and here we get bumkins with a side of pollution. to keep us sick and continually going to the doctors.

            I say stop all the foolishness with future Mineral of our state, it is actually doing nothing to propel our interest in our Montana heritage when its not owned by Montanans who care.

            We have over 300 abandon mines in montana in my area alone that needs to be cleaned up…..I would rather protect recreation, tourism, and clean water. I would focus more on renewable timber resources… and getting our forests cleaned up from pine and moth infestation. revitalizing our meadows. and finding ways to protect the headwaters in our state as much as possible… than we might entertain going back to mining, when we decide the right protections are in place so future Montanans can continue to breathe clean air, and drink clean water…..

    • Where were the Dillon Democrats? I only saw Libertarians and Republicans.
      Speaking of freedom, Montana received a rare visit from Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia last week. Jennifer doesn’t realize that Scalia doesn’t support the Top Two Primary and wrote the dissenting opinion in the case of Washington Republican Party VS Washington Grange. Besides the Federalist Society is libertarian not republican, and they also don’t like the Top Two Primary in LR 127.

      • We believe a Labor Day Parade, should be for Labor, the little working Guy, not promoting politics. We sided with the American people down here, and choose not to stink up the Parade with politics.

        • and trust me, we sat down and discussed this, emailed it between party members, and just decided to hang out with our fellow Dillonites fro labor day festivities.

        • No offense, Norma, but I think that was a bad decision. The Republicans were out in force and the Daines-bots were working overtime. A lot of facetime was had by the Republicans (one even tried to convince me that the Montana Republican party was trying to return to the “Ike” style of Republican Support – sadly, that person had no idea what she was talking about and it showed). I, too, have seen a lot of talk about “Daines wanting to be bipartisan” from campaigners. Sadly for them, I am well aware that Daines is a corporatist. He proudly admits it – loudly and often.

          • Really? Why I will respect your opinion, I wholeheartedly disagree.

            Unless labor invites you…. which I guarantee you–did not happen with Daines and his muppets. I believe the day belongs to the working American.

            According to your premise, politicians should also be out there for christmas celebrations and the rose parade? Yeah, they do it, but its not about them is it?

            Next thing you know they will want to be part of the super bowl halftime show!

            I think it cheapens American celebrations, when they try and politicize it. Like the war on christmas when there is none.

  2. By the way no town hall from Daines here yet in the Beaverhead Area!

    • Did you expect one? Daines is a corporatist. What is there in Beaverhead County that he would give a crap about? The County will vote for him because he has an “R” after his name. That is all Daines needs to know about Beaverhead County. Now if there were some large moneyed interest in this county, I am sure that Daines would be wooing us just like he has the moneyed interests in Yellowstone Country etc.

      • Attention Moorecat, we are in Koch Country here, and the matador ranch does sit on Gas reserves. Hate to bust your bubble, but we will be smelling gas in our water one day… just so you know. Why the hell do you think they bought it?????? For Cows?

        • Norma… it is Moorcat or Kenneth, not Moorecat. Please, I have tried to be respectful in my replies, mangling my avatar is disconcerting. It is no different than Mark calling Rob, Rod.

          There is no bubble to burst, Norma. While you may well be right about what the Koch’s intend for the land they bought, the fact remains that Beaverhead county is only 16,000 people (about 4,000 votes) and while there is money in this valley, it is primarily tied up in agriculture. There isn’t a lot of money to be had here for campaigns and that is what Daines is looking at. Moreover, this county will vote Republican just like it has for as long as anyone can remember. This country will vote for Daines whether he visits here or not, just like it voted for Conman Burns and Richy Rich Rehberg. It is pretty much a no brainer. The only that remains is how big a victory Daines will enjoy in the election. I will give you, Richard, LaVon and others credit in that you have occasionally eaten into the leads these Republican Candidates have had, but they have still gotten the lion’s share of the vote here and will probably continue to do so in the foreseeable future.

          • And I will continue to work to change that a norm for me.

            Lets face it short of not voting…. the Montanans down here have had no choice in candidates for years, Yet continue to vote for Jon Tester in a large enough swath that tells me they are open to choice..

          • “Norma… it is Moorcat or Kenneth, not Moorecat. Please, I have tried to be respectful in my replies, mangling my avatar is disconcerting. It is no different than Mark calling Rob, Rod.”

            Wow, a bit sensitive there, eh big guy? I mean, it is no different than Rob calling Dave “Skinhead” or Rob calling various people “Cup cake.” Or Rob calling Mark “Toke.” Or Rob admitting numerous times in the past he intentionally misspells my last name as “Kohler.” Or you, Moorcat, calling people on this blog “arrogant, self centered assholes” and the Brother’s Kailey talking about everyone’s “Butthurt” “buttholes” and “asses.” Do you guys honestly not notice or comprehend your own behavior?

            • Yea thats kinda the way it is here Matthew….I roll with it now.

              It was just a honest spelling mistake at 3 am in the morning…. now days I just ignore it.

              The Mr does have a past… I think he forgets I know it!

              • You make that spelling mistake often, Norma, and your threats about my “pasts” are simply idiotic. You are misinformed and you continue to insist that you know something that you really don’t. Give it up. Your personal attacks on me are counter productive. I have not attacked you personally, I have simply asked you to quit mangling my avatar. Moreover, I asked nicely, something that seems to be lost on you.

                • You live in a paranoid world about extra “e’s”, Mr Kenneth and you right, your past is Idiotic… Going AWOL from the Navy, assuming another name to hide from that, leaving your first and second families without even saying goodbye…. reads like a fiction novel.

                  You cant work because your wages are garnished you cant drive….Your the farthest thing from being Mr. Perfect there is Kenneth… and you need to lecture me, about a late night commenting? While I waited for a taxi fare? Should I go on?

                  Like I said I was gonna let it roll……. but you have this, penchant for wanting to have the last say, sticking your foot in it… when you should learn to keep your trap….

                  • As predicted, you went there. Of course you went there. Simple courtesy is beyond you. As usual, you spout wild supposition as fact and you think you are scoring points when in fact, you have no clue what you are talking about. You know, Norma, idiots like you are the reasons Democrats have such a hard time proving they are any better than the Republicans.

                    • Its not wild accusations Mr Kenneth, its the truth! You admitted to losing your license right here on this blog,. you were arrested for driving in Dillon without a drivers license. For not paying back child support. yeah you blamed the government for your shortcomings and Marty our mayor! Do you really expect people who get slammed by you unfairly in your blog not to check your past life?

                      You expect me to step down, without asking those questions too? Really????

                      Maybe if there were less joe walsh’s in the world like you, less deadbeat dads, the world could run a tick faster Huh? Its not because I am a Democrat, that your mad at me, its because I just don’t take shit from people who shovel it… like you!

                      Let me refresh you memory, and everyone else’s here March 7, 2013


                    • Lastly if you want to get treated like an adult Mr Kelly James Silvan. start living the truth!

                    • Let me get this straight “stormin norma”. I ask you to stop mangling my name and you escalate by making wild ass accusations (which again you have no idea what you are talking about), and you seem to feel this somehow qualifies you as a political candidate (or even a decent human being)? You are an idiot Norma. You represent everything wrong with pseudo politicians these days.

                      My name is Kenneth. You can attempt to call me anything you want, but you are simply showing how completely unqualified you are to have any authority or political position. Go ahead, Stormin… keep running your mouth and showing what a self important idiot you are.

            • No more or less than you comprehend your own, ‘Matthew’.

              Seriously, look at you. A ‘man of principle’ sucking up for agreement from someone he has insulted more times and far worse than ever I have you. You demean Democrats and Tester supporters as being unwitting drones; you demean Norma with 4 out of every 5 comments you make online. But hey, if she agrees with you about a common opponent you’re all cool with that, right?

              It’s clear that Norma made a typo. It’s also pretty clear that Kenneth took offense because ‘Moore’ attached to “Moorecat” carries the connotation of insult given that Craig Moore is such an underhanded wingnut manipulation machine himself. What we had here was a failure to communicate, one your petty little ass couldn’t resist trying to capitalize on for favor.

              My brother and I are not the same. We disagree, a lot. But you, Koehler, have an agenda that lumps us into one handy package you want others to dismiss. That effort on your part is based on the fact that we both think, with evidence, that you are full of shit. You argue with the same pattern all the time, and it’s weak, never to get stronger. First, you attempt to assert your authority concerning any topic. None can know as much as you. *break out the trumpet fanfare* That has never been established and has actually been shown to be wrong many times. You then rely on public opinion, not about the topic, but about the persons who disagree with you, just as you do here. You’ve had a bit of success with that, but if you had half the skill you think you do and even an ounce of courage, you’d become a politician such you might actually get what you want. You don’t, you don’t, and you won’t. On this, I am certain my brother and I completely agree. You are a punk-ass coward who only swoops in to weakly beg for disagreement *about us* from those you revile against those who clearly see how full of shit you actually are.

              That you are ‘butthurt’ isn’t anything but an observation with the obvious evidence behind it. Look at you whining about what we say about you as if it isn’t true when you offer no evidence to the contrary. No, you are just attempting to manipulate opinion based on some ridiculous idea of ‘cultural norms’ that one is impolite for pointing out obvious butthurt. Welcome to the Internet, Kohler. I don’t care if I’m impolite. When you are butthurt, I’m likely going to point it out. You can argue with me, or … You can waste everybody’s time and effort trying to convince folks that you are the righteous commenter in the face of this brotherly Eveil! Your choice, of course, unless you don’t want to take responsibility for your own actions …

              The latter is very likely.

              • Thank you, Rob, for pointing out what I thought was obvious. The number of times “Moorecat” has been used to identify me, I considered a personal slight as I perceived that as being some kind of connection between me and Craig Moore. We are NOT the same person, we do NOT believe the same things and I have taken Craig to task as much as anyone else on this site. If that was not the intention, than I apologize, but it happens a LOT.

              • Huh, Kailey?

  3. Oh my goodness gracious! I hope this is a case of simple ignorance that mere information and facts will set aright. But whatever shall we do about her need to create a busywork commission?

  4. I look for meaningful differences between the parties. Moral superiority is neither’s calling card. Perhaps it’s that ability to pull an ace out of the hat and bomb innocent civilians and cause a refugee crisis. But there you are oly as good as, and to better than the Bushies.

  5. Mark, I’ve written this well over a couple of dozen times in over a dozen ways, and you still willfully won’t get it. You look at the parties as if they are compelling entities when they are nothing of the sort. They are branding which will garner almost mindless favor from 25% to 27% of the population. Yes, ~50% of the population is arguing Coke v. Pepsi. Those are not the same, but to you, they are because they are both colas. If someone wants a cola, they are going to choose one of them. That doesn’t mean they were COMPELLED to do so.

    You don’t see any difference between one cola and another. Quite obviously, at least 50% of the people do. So you caterwaul that there can be no difference between them when all empirical evidence suggests there is. You focus on the 50% who have already made up their minds and can’t be swayed, and then insult the hell out of the rest of us (50% of the population!) by telling us we’ve been swayed by marketing and pegged into holes which make you feel comfortable. No, Mark. It’s misunderstanding math, grossly insulting your fellow citizens, and kinda stupid.

    The majority of Americans favored single payer, including me. But if we actually thought Obamacare might be an improvement, we were nothing but ‘Pepsi cola lovers’, and they are problem because they like cola. The majority of Americans don’t favor NSA spying, but the problem is those of us who wanted a cola and chose the D- Pepsi instead of the R-Coke. Seriously? The colas are very different. The branding isn’t. But that doesn’t matter to you. You are going to point the finger at any who ever supported a cola. You can’t support RC because, well, it’s cola. You think we should all be drinking iced Chi tea. Good luck with that.

    Toke, you are looking for moral superiority in a venue where moral superiority is meaningless. Numerical superiority is all-powerful. So, if 25% is committed to a flavor, and another 25% is committed to another flavor, doesn’t it make sense to woo the 50% that actually cares about morality to the side that best enables the 25% you might agree with? Apparently not to you.

    • I think the validation of my argument, using your analogy, can be found in blind taste tests where people cannot tell the difference between Coke and Pepsi. The “flavor” of Coca Cola is contained in the color of the can, and oddly, when compared to Pepsi, we are talking red versus blue. That’s weird now that I think of it. But people genuinely perceive a difference in flavor when told they are drinking one instead of the other. Suggestion is all it is – power of suggestion.

      It’s a complicated psychological maneuver to take the same product, in the case of Syria, for example, an illegal aggressive war on a sovereign state, and claim that, because Pepsi is dong it, that it is substantially different than when Coke has done it before.

      In the case of Obamacare, it was a maneuver to stake out a larger market share and huge subsidy for private insurers while allowing them to scale back benefits and under-insure everyone. But because Pepsi did it, people were more accepting. Coke could not have gotten away with it because of different marketing perceptions. (I’ve read comments here, fairly typical I’m afraid, and people are not aware of contractual details of health insurance policies, but rather only monthly premiums. Hence, they will flock to the cheapest policies, and have essentially hospitalization-only policies with very high deductibles and out-of-pocket costs. I refuse to believe that more than 1-5% of the population understand the details of ACA.)

      I understand that people are insulted when told they are being conned. As I looked at my brand new IMac, I felt the same revulsion, having bought into a sophisticated ad campaign to get me pay more for the same product in different package. I am susceptible to marketing too. There is only one way to defeat advertising and perception management: Be aware of it. It vanishes with a “poof!”

      • Come on Rob, you’re arguing with a man who has no Moral compass himself…. so should he explain it, or opine on it….. it will always come out twisted.

        Mark is a guy who doesn’t vote. wont put his ass on the line to vote, doesn’t give a shit about his country to vote, doesn’t care for his community or family enough to even push a shad through….

        • and as far as Obamacare here the IRS as already carved out an exception for Idiots in our state who won’t join Marketplace.

          Since our GOP in state politics have refused to allow the state billions in dollars in ACA monies to set up even a single payer here…. they like Mark cannot complain.

          Lastly, Mark is susceptible only to Colorado politics, thats where he lives, where he works, were he goes home. He lost sight of Montana values and care for Montana People long ago.

      • Could have sworn Rob and I were having an exchange. What are you, the crosswalk guard? Do you have a little orange vest and a whistle? Bug off.

        • Nope! Stupid dumb comments from Jerks like you get flagged for the codswallop they spew here. Stay in Colorado where you belong two face. Cry your toxic river, somewhere else.

          A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of the user.
          ~Theodore Roosevelt~

          You Mark, have no character!

        • You’re like a carnival barker yelling out at passersby, not knowing them or anything about them, but in your case you hurl ugly insults. What a sad lonely person you must be, how dreary your life, that you spend so much time here, take up so much band width, and offer so little insight and so much agitation. Is this all there is for you? I’ve come to develop respect for many people that I encounter on the blogs, even as we deeply disagree, as do Rob and I. But you don’t offer any substance, nothing to counter with argument. If we engage, it is only to exchange insults, and that is childish. Again, bug off. (PS: My 59 years as a Montanan probably trumps almost everyone else at this blog, including the writers.)

          • Man your so full of crap! Mark we’ll need to designate miles of that area you live in Colorado as a toxic zone, should you burp out anymore of that garbage you’re spewing….

            And you’re an accountant? if you’re 59 years old and lived in Colorado since 2007, that makes you a resident of colorado not Montana for the last 61/2 years….. And not very good at simple arithmetic either.

            Therefore not a Montanan all your life!

            And this state like all others has a lot of sell-outs, and people who whine and complain just like you, who stand for nothing while here and then just leave…. and never want to talk about the fact that they don’t vote their conscience, because they don’t have one. Yah thats you……………..

            “He who stands for nothing will fall for anything.”
            ― Alexander Hamilton―

            Lastly, I told you almost a year ago, You’re a lying piece of dung, and for some reason you think I should lighten my tone to you? Not Happening!
            You have done nothing to disprove your ignorance, there are no facts present currently for me to consider you worthy of any leniency in the future either.

            So expect to be called out on all you diversion, Hocus-pocus, Fact-lacking opinions, and deary bashing of America that doesn’t fit your conformity…..

            Name calling? Hell I am just presenting the facts regarding your daily hogwash…. don’t ask me to be sorry for poking holes in your conspiracies. … you so deserve it!

            • Typed like a true Californian.
              Norma, who you are depends on where you grew up. While I don’t agree with Toke on many things, he is clearly a product of Montana in his thinking — Montana is not a monoculture.
              Toke actually has a pretty good point about branding. It’s writ large with the current guff about Syria. All the peaceniks including that Easter Island statue known as John Kerry are now beating the drums of armed response. And what if it were either McSame or Flip McRomney spouting nonsense? Oh, that’s right, McSame’s on board but if he were president, you would be having fits.
              Mark is correct here.

              • Hey I Love California, but I have owned a house here since the 70’s. and worked wherever the money was good. Oh excuse me, I forgot you GOP guys don’t think women should be able to go where the money is, and have a homebase here…. thats a guys world or only guys are successful at that? huh???

                Let me tell you about where I grow up. Im the one who bought the home in Montana for my folks to retire in in the 70’s

                My Dad moved us where his jobs took him. California is only one state, Idaho, Pennsylvania, Florida, Saudi Arabia, Colorado, Minnesota, Washington….See my father was a nuclear engineer control room specialist, and before that he worked on NASA projects, and before that was the military….He went wherever he wished, We followed. All our relatives on my moms side owned Farms, and or ranches of fruit trees, Walnuts, Cattle Alfalfa and dairy cows. Every summer I spent on my uncles and aunts farms planting, breaking horses, Milking or driving cattle, Driving tractors, moving Pipe etc. my Family believed in the total understanding of what it is like to be an American,

                I have a little more life experience under my belt then you give me credit for…. and I have a better understanding of the USA and other countries, than you or Mark can Imagine. Because of my connections in racing I’ve worked in the Canada, UK, Ireland, Australia France. Nevada, Arizona, New York, Florida, Louisiana, North Carolina I know what people expect of Americans in other countries, and I have seen a bigger swath of the American people than both of you combine…..

                That being said! Mark and you are talking, writing and spewing information from a very narrow conservative swath of America. You have no view of your own, except the eyes of other journalists…… I am beginning to believe you believe in your own codswallop. and chances are you will never get out of that rut.

                Mark is not worth reading. because he cannot even recite his own reality. and if you believe that ignoring syria will protect us from the discrimination of poison Gas, you’re both inept!

              • Dead-on, Mr. Skinner, my own persona aside, on branding and what I call (not hardly original) perception management. Because the Syria attack is being managed by Democrats, Democrats are now the party of illegal aggressive war. This is the same party that won control of Congress in 2006 in opposition to the Iraq war, and then sat on their hands. Kerry is a piece of work, is he not? His Skull and Bones upbringing puts him in The Bush League, a really creepy cult.

            • Geez Norma, here’s the math: Born in 1950, lived in Billings until 2001, Bozeman until 2009, active in politics throughout, candidate for legislature (D) 1996, trounced by Peggy Arnott, a superior politician (and good person). Moved to Colorado 2009 to be with some of our grand kids. That makes me 63 with 59 years in Montana. Check it on your calculator: 2009-1950 =59.

              • So you gave your self 2 more years. from our last conversation on Cowgirl website from last summer??? Really??? Again proving to me once again what a lying dog you are. Whats wrong Mark? Is it you lie so much you cant remember what you wrote here????

                Only a fool would believe your dribble…. But carry on with your indiscretions of BS, it gives me a good laugh!!!!!!

                2009???? Bwahahahaha

                • Like I said before about both of you…. inept Bullshitters!

                • Meds, Norma. Meds and bed rest. Perhaps you should avoid blogging, as it obviously upsets you.

                  • I like blogging Mark, I just don’t let certain kinds categories of people like you and Dave get away with Crap.

                    I won’t let:
                    Fools jerks, morons, nitwits,stupid, twits, simpletons, tomfools, blockheads, boneheads, cretins, dimwits, dorks, dumbbells,dunces, ignoramuses, imbeciles, kooks, muttonheads, nincompoops, ninnys, pinheads,or folk who live in the “out to lunch” world tell me complete bullshit… Or lie, as you and the other conservative ilk that drinks conspiracy kool aid try to pass off BS here on a democratic blog every day.

                    Wouldn’t you nutcases be happier somewhere else… like your Blog Mark? Or is the quality of your commentors not up to the par of Cowgirls??????

                    Funny thing……. the fact that these particular categories, of people names above, are almost always part of one national party called Republicans…. and the second funny thing is many of those categories are the complete and utter description of you Mark, plus Dave.

                    I really think Webster Dictionary would do a better service to their online reference if they just use your photo for any of the following named terms above…. Just saying!

                    • Bitter much???? The “Montana penis measuring contest” between you two as to who is the “real” Montanan based on length of stay was funny, but you just looked petty and childish.

                      Perhaps you should stop blogging if you only like to be surrounded by the voices of people who agree with your every word.

                      I guess in your world it’s not okay for right leaning individuals to post on a left-leaning blog but you have no compunction with regard to a left leaning individual posting on a right-leaning blog.

                    • Dammit, now I’ve done it. I argued with her, and am being lumped with her. I do not care who has been in Montana longest, as place of birth is irrelevant. There is no such thing as “Montana values,” only values. They are everywhere the same, as are people. Being from or born in Montana means no more than Brooklyn or Damascus. People are people.

                    • After referencing the two of you, I should have stated SHE was the one looking petty and childish with the long screed of personal attacks. I never intended to lump you in with her.

                    • Thanks.

                    • There are plenty of conservatives that read this site and even a few that comment. Not all conservatives are of the slobbering, Jesus fearing, gun stroking, racist, illiterate, drunk or ignorant variety. Nor are all liberals of the tree hugging, lawsuit filing, “let’s lock up all the wilderness”, let’s completely defund the military, let’s get rid of all the guns type. There is plenty of room in the middle for intelligent people to discuss issues rationally and logically even if we all come at those issues from different places.

                    • Wow Mark You split into two personalities there…. Dude you cant seem to get rid of that writing style can you ???

                      Nice try, but I am not moved!

      • Mark, the purchase of your iMac is an instructive example. We could discuss it’s relative merits as opposed to it’s faults. It has a small footprint, superior display, excellent visual design (remarkably important to many people), well tested and robust architecture and large internal storage. However, it is limited in storage upgrade without external peripherals which negate the footprint advantage, it cannot be worked on by the enthusiast, it has an alien operating system in the minds of those familiar with the more popular Windows, and an inflated bang for the buck. These are arguments and considerations.

        If you assume, ex post facto, that it is marketing that convinced you to make that purchase than you are arguing with a Hindsight bias. That’s a fallacy; marketing may be the culprit or maybe not. What removes it from any examination of the truth is that the bias explains based on an assumption that negates all other factors that could have held sway before the purchasing decision was made. I don’t think I’m being insulting in pointing out that when it comes to politics, you apply the Hindsight bias all the freaking time. That doesn’t annoy some/most of us because you are pointing out a particular weakness of intelligence and character regarding marketing. It is annoying because you are using a fallacy to preempt and bury any other examination or reasoning.

        I’m currently working through my predictions for how the NFL divisions will pan out this season. It’s remarkably easy to look back at last season and say, well, the Ravens won because the NFL is a market and the Ravens brought the Drama. Ray Lewis announced his retirement. Joe Flacco felt under-appreciated in a contract year. The implications of that are pretty significant. Rahim Moore had to be in on the fix because he jumped early and missed an obvious block on the hail mary pass in Denver. If one can accept that assumption, then no assumption is unreasonable as long as it leads to the ultimate outcome of the Ravens winning the big game. That’s the very problem with the Hindsight bias. It doesn’t actually explain anything. The only thing it does is demand that one start with a result and assume cause backwards.

        • I have long noted that sports predictions are usually based on last year’s results, and that when a very good team comes along and wins, as the TB Rays a few years ago, no one saw it coming. That is the problem with the future. It is unpredictable.

          The IMac and your response are a bit beyond my computer skills. You appear to know enough about the products to spot a superior/inferior ones, and you’re dead-on that I am steeped in Windows muscle memory. I just noted that it was hard to adapt to, and that when I loaded Parallel, as I had programs that needed Windows, it was just a old and slow computer. (Quickbooks for Mac, btw, is an inferior product.) Our (my step) son is in advertising, and said to me at one point as he noted our Ipad, IPhones and IMac, something to the effect that “Advertising works, doesn’t it.” Apple’s award-winning strategy was to create an aura around the product, to create a legion of followers who worshiped the product. I totally got sucked into it. My PC was perfectly functional. As I used the IMac a cloud slowly settled around me. I’d been sucked in by clever advertising.

          That’s reality, that is, though it’s a analysis of past experience, it’s self-reflective and (I hope) honest. The same thing happens in politics occasionally. I wait for anyone sucked in the the Iraq agitprop campaign to step forward now and admit that Syria could be a repeat, even if being done by the other party, perception-wise.

        • BTW, you surely know this: The Apple ad campaign, which was I think in 2008 doing “I’m a Mac/I’m a PC”, placed third in the annual advertising awards. Taking first place was the Obama “Hope and Change” ad campaign. Somehow, an ad agency had managed to create an aura around a product.

  6. Montana’s very own Michele Bachmann, how long before he’s on Fox News?

  7. Daines should be having ‘labor’ pains…..And really Ms. Fielder, have you read the Federalist Papers??

  8. So, kids, who are you running against Fielder next cycle? Norma, are you moving to Superior?

    • Why is a welfare farmer/rancher like a 747?

      They both whine all the way to Hawaii!

      Galt still use his helicopter to spot elk? And BTW, who is the billionaire that built a huge mansion home back up there next to the Galt place up in the Belts?

    • NOpe not moving to Superior Mt. HOnestly I dont think I have ever been there, maybe blew by it once or twice…… I like Beaverhead county just fine. I own a nice house, next to the golf course, a clear view of the Mountains, great neighbors. and a nice life. why move when I can run down here again?

  9. Are you sure you like Beaverhead? Folks are saying you are kind of vocal otherwise.

  10. Really? What folks Dave???? I just started two businesses down here, seem to be taking off just fine…. why would I do that if I don’t intend to stay???

  11. While on the subject of Civics Fail, I want all of those unwilling to help Syrians tell me why they are not a party to any treaty, now in
    force, that prohibits or restricts the use in warfare of
    toxic or nontoxic gases … or of bacteriological warfare??

    Why they will allow these gases to be used on civilian populations elsewhere, and why they believe that it will never happen to them here because of their indifference?

    • Norma, you are setting up a false dichotomy using the fallacy of the excluded middle. Those of us unwilling to strike Syria with the power of the US Military Industrial Complex may not be at all “unwilling to help Syrians”. If the Syrian government is unwilling to sign a treaty, then seriously what right do we have to tell them what to do? Bigger better explosives?

      And frankly put, who the hell are you to decide who is ‘indifferent’?

    • Norma, has Israel signed the Nuclear non-proliferation treaty? I assume you must support cutting off all aid to Israel on this basis but should we even go so far as to launch punitive military strikes to teach the Israelis a lesson? Do you consider white phosphorus a poison gas?

    • Rob has pointed out the logical fallacy quite well but it should be noted that the Syrian situation if far too complicated to be put in a few sentences. Like Rob, I have serious doubts about any kind of military strike against Syria based not only on my military experience, but the military and intelligence experience of people that are still actively working in that field. Syria is a rat’s nest and there are NO good options at this point – only a choice of bad options. In my opinion, it would be far better for the US to await the UN’s investigation and attempt some diplomatic options (not the least of which is to try to work out some of the differences we have with Russia over this particular issue) before we go in “guns ablazin”.

      One of the best takes I have seen on the situation was posted on Stonekettle station – by a man that has spent his entire life in military intelligence. I would suggest anyone discussing Syria to read his post and the discussion that followed.

  12. Trolling by GOP operatives is on the uptake here. The point is to try to intimidate the rest of us into not commenting by calling us names, belittling us, obscuring and hijacking the comments and generally being nasty.

    I’m reading their presence as a sign they are scared.

  13. That’s my guess now that Stapleton is running for Senate, or House, or whatever it is this week.

  14. I believe you already know the answer to that Question on the Nuclear non-proliferation treaty which is “no” Jack!

    Israel hasn’t even acknowledged they have Nukes publically, and far be it from me to understand their reasoning for not saying or signing….my Guess would be because that would mean giving up its military edge in the Middle East.( like we don’t do the same here? with the 7700 nuclear devices we have compared to an educated guess in stockpile of Israel of 50)…. that being said, and since I have no idea what you’re alluding to for argument, (maybe distraction)? I will move on to arguing About Willie Petes .

    Let us now expand on the fact that our military used white phosphorus in 2004, in Iraq. Bush used white phosphorus as a weapon in Fallujah causing insurgents and civilians to be killed or injured by chemical burns. he also used of the MK 77 firebomb in Baghdad and Tora Bora. The weapon may not share the same composition as napalm, although it has similar destructive characteristics, regarding that targets still get burned to death. The mixture in M 77’s reportedly contains an oxidizing agent, making it impossible to put it out with water, just like napalm. Imagine a big 750 pound bomb of that stuff, landing in places where civilians were present? yeah we used over 40,000 pounds of MK 77’s in Iraq.

    And no, Willy Petes are not considered a Gas.According to the field manual on the Rule of Land Warfare, “The use of weapons which employ fire, such as tracer ammunition, flamethrowers, napalm and other incendiary agents, against targets requiring their use is not violation of international law.” Chapter 2 section 36.

    Or hell why don’t we talk about the use, by the bush administration of depleted uranium bullets in Iraq. Some 2,000 tons of depleted uranium bullets, which can combust into a ball of fire measuring 10,000 Centigrade degrees, were utilized in the invasion of Iraq. At least 200 tons were used after the invasion. Iraqi Children exposed to the munitions have come down with leukemia all over the now freed county? Free to continue suffering….. America has a very recent dark history indeed with you Bush lovers

    It is amazing to me how lillywhite everyone on the right is about America in Iraq, even though it was premised on a lie by the Bush administration.

    Somehow you want to place some of that Bush bullshit blame on Obama now. Really??? How Bush did everything by the book, and tried not to don’t kill civilians??? WTF? we just tortured, burnt them to death, or gave them cancer…. the only rule that most countries agree too and the Bush Administration threw out the window in his little wars of Iraq and Afghanistan ….Was that we do not cause unnecessary suffering of civilians.

    This is not Iraq, this is not Afghanistan, this is the use of Gas WMDS against civilian populations in Syria. this is a true violation of the Geneva convention….

    First of all I said nothing of bombing Syria, I said I want to help Syria and was very happy to see Obama try and help, we wont go to war we will just watch the consequences of non action… just like we did with the Jews in germany…..until we have that new pearl harbor

    While you all gripe that Obama wants to go to war…. he has already proved this scenario isn’t true. While reporters not journalists keep hyping tomahawk missles… Obama’s administration has already approached.

    The UN, but China and Russia will veto the UN Security Council from taking action. they have place papers with the UN General Assembly, which could act under the powers of the Uniting for Peace Resolution of 1950, but it is not in session and likely to block action when reconvened in September, as the membership is similar to the OPCW’s Conference.

    The Hague, headquarters of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW). An OPCW expert team was part of the UN weapons inspection team in Syria. But on July 16, the American delegate complained that the Ukrainian chairing OPCW’s Executive Committee refused to place the issue on the agenda for discussion.,,,

    I believe he has tried to do the right thing first, the peaceful thing before more civilians die…I’m thinking this, moving ships into place, was the last play he had….. a threat where he hoped Assad would back down, or get scared enough to move his pieces of war under the Microscope of satellite imagery…. Giving this information alone to the rebels will help them. Not to mention loosening the purse strings of the congress enough to get the rebels needed supplies…. but not acting on this in any manner like you Isolationists want, will just embolden Assad, Kim’s North korea, and any other desperate group that wants rid the world of change.

    I don’t believe any president is perfect, when it comes to wars, but if I remember correctly Obama inherited Bushes wars. we have already seen Obama’s handling of war in libya….Amazing how no one is talking about that. Or even getting Bin Laden, something Bush could never do.

    Yeah according to some people hes the same as Bush??? Really????

    Ah No!

  15. Ok Norma let me make sure I understand you correctly:

    1) Syria’s refusal to sign a treaty banning chemical weapons is evidence they use chemical weapons on their own citizens (and will use them on the US) and is a reason we should attack them militarily;

    2) Israel’s refusal to sign a treaty banning the proliferation of nuclear weapons and providing for the inspection and accounting thereof is just simply them not wanting to give up their military edge and “far be it from you” to judge them.

    You don’t seem to have a problem with white phosphorus I suppose as the chemicals its composed of merely burn people alive as opposed to being a choking or nerve agent. Apples and oranges I suppose. Now I can see why you approve of Israel using white phosphorus to burn civilians alive in the Gaza strip while disapproving of the use of choking or nerve agents. (Although I suppose the distinction is probably lost on the people who are being burned alive.)

    You rambled on and on quite a bit. I think you accused me of being a Bush lover? You really do just reflexively attack anyone who you think disagrees with you as a Republican. I have to say I find it a little disturbing that you can’t see the double standard you employ here and find no irony in criticizing the war in Iraq while supporting the use of force in Syria. It makes me question your psychological health although the truth be told I’ve long assumed you to be mentally ill based on the things you write here.

    • Soon you’ll be pulling your hair out, Jack. She’s not ratiosl. People who are to reasoned in, cannot be reasoned out.

  16. Soon you’ll be pulling your hair out, Jack. She’s not rational. People who are not reasoned in, cannot be reasoned out.

    [it really bugs me that “not” becomes “to” on the IPad, as most times I do not catch it until too late.

  17. PS: Israel has also not signed the treaty banning chemical weapons.

  18. I will Love the day when some of you commenters can stay on subject. Jack why are you acting like Mark now?

    Adding supposition are we now? Guessing at what I might say??? your questions were pretty friggen vague to begin with Jack… So now your gonna lecture me cause I dont carry around a crystal ball, to understand exactly what you were saying? Really?

    Attention Jack I am an American Jew, not an Israeli one. are you inferring I am different than you, I have some mystical tie that is different than the christian religion, which is actually based on my religion?

    Did I have to take some special test to be a complete American, because part of my family came from the Jewish part of Poland a generation ago?

    Or are you having some problem with my point? That Republican America is living in the same dark past as Israel has, and really…. President Bushes,America can’t point fingers because of the torture, burning, and maiming we as a nation did also? We Used Willie Petes, we Used MK77’s, we used Uranium bullets on civilians Jack…. You can’t sit there at your keyboard and tell me we are not a thug country also, that it isn’t the same thing? Are you really that Naive???

    Has anyone in Israel, been convicted of 268 war crimes, like Bush was for Iraq and Afghanistan and yet he’s never been arrested, because america wont extradite him??

    I’ll wait!

    Lastly Obama, is nothing like Bush folks, but don’t let that get in the way of your science fiction!

  19. Norma, were you frothing at the mouth as you typed that? What relevance does your sense of victimization from being jewish have to anything? Do you think that if Obama orders strikes on syria he is going to order the us military to not use DU weapons? It’s clear you aren’t able to analyze an issue in any orderly fashion in your mind and reach logical & orderly conclusions. I have to say, as a far left supporter and donater to the democratic party I think you could have been as damaging as any right wing bagger in the legislature. Far better for you to be ranting and throwing tantrums on the internet. This is probably good as it gives you an outlet to try and sort out your confused thoughts.

    • And this is why I will never support fanatics like Norma. She has not concept of representation or even consistency. Her tantrums are epic and she loves to hear the sound of her own voice (or read her own words on the internet as the case may be). Luckily for us, Norma will never get elected in his county. She deludes herself into believing that she “represents” the majority of House District 72, but most people here just see her as a loud mouthed, ill tempered shrew. Her tendency to insult, belittle, harass and argue with anyone that has the temerity to disagree with ANYTHING she says or does, and her tendency to try to make everything into a gender based issue pretty much guarantee that she will go nowhere politically in this county.

    • Remind us again, Norma, how much of the vote you got in the last election…

    • Hey Jack, did you know that Human Rights Watch found the Willie Petes were manufactured in the United States in 1989 by Thiokol Aerospace, which was running the Louisiana Army Ammunition Plant at the time.

      Yep we were selling and were the suppliers of white phosphorus!

  20. Post whatever crap and assumptions you want Jack any intelligent person can see your inferences, thats why all your original questioning was so vague. You got called on the carpet with the USA being holier than others when it comes to war and that just doesn’t wash with real people. and apparently it doesn’t bother you we as a country made huge mistakes predicated by a lie from the leader of republicans, as much as Israel? Really?

    And MoorCat, you flat lied about the whole Mayor the marty affair on the internet. You told people on the net our mayor took your License away, he imprisoned you unjustly, when all along it was just you being a deadbeat dad to how many families??? how many families did you sire?

    I could be moved to post the Family court case where the Judge based on a doctor’s expertise said you were not fit to raise your first daughter…You certifiably have been considered insane in Family court.
    And you still haven’t explained that AWOL or changing your name.

    Tell me again where people like you count in a community that cares for their children here in Dillon. How much do you think I care for that kind of vote as a woman??? How much do you think I care, about a person like that?

    Treating the whole world as if you think works for you, or doesn’t mind that you would lie to your own….. doesn’t suggest you’re special. It means you’re an ass….. just remember that, cause I won’t be included in your circle of lying to yourself or others, anytime soon.

    People need to know that the road carries false educators like you

    • Norma, do the research you claim to do and obviously don’t. You will realize that empty legal lies (“You (sic) certifiably have been considered insane in Family court”) is evidence of stalking and libel. You should consider where you go from here. I know you won’t, but at least show some evidence that you’re trying? Any evidence of intelligence at all would be helpful.

    • Norma… As usual, you are a raving lunatic. I DID raise my first daughter (as well as my first son) as a single parent without help of any kind from their mother. Further, I never said that Mayor Malesich took my license. I said that Mayor Malesich illegally used his position as mayor to run a background check on me and then (with the help of a sitting City Councilman – Troadsson) had me arrested for driving on a suspended license. This was all reported in numerous newspapers in Montana and simple search would have shown you that if you had enough brains to actually do one. You have no clue what you are talking about – again – and what makes this so much worse is that many of the readers here are fully aware of the circumstances behind the Mayor having me arrested. Yes, I owe back child support on my youngest daughter – I have never denied it. After being laid off at Intel, my license was taken away before I could get a new job. Until that time, I paid child support – to the tune of $40,000. Until I can pay off the remainder of my child support, I will continue to be without a license (makes a lot of sense doesn’t it – take away a person’s licenses to work to make them pay child support…). Deal with that simple fact for a second you myopic dwarf. I raised two children – on my own – and because I got behind on child support for a third child ( a child she had on purpose to get me to marry her), I am somehow a “deadbeat dad”. You are a twisted, sick work of art, Norma…

    • It should also be pointed out that when Mayor Malesich and City Councilman Troaddson conspired to have me arrested, my wife was running against Troaddson for City Council. Even with the lies spread around town (lies you have apparently bought into hook line and sinker) by Malesich to try to discredit my wife, she won against Troaddson by a comfortable margin. The political race angle was also mentioned in the local paper and the regional papers.

      There, Norma, I have given you a jump off point to do your research. What I would like to know is why you – a potential political candidate is doing spending so much time, effort and pixels on trying to character assassinate a potential voter in your district? Do you really perceive me as that much of a threat to you? Are you really that stupid that a simple voter in your district requires such investigation? I pity you, Norma. You are the one appearing to be deranged.

    • Oh, and one more thing. I will be discussing your libel (and potential stalking, though I do not personally feel that your actions have crossed that line yet) with an attorney. Remember that the court case you are referring to was one in which I was actually involved in and I have ALL the paperwork on file. You are grossly incorrect about the judge’s finding and your misrepresentation absolutely crosses the libel line.

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